[buck]

Hi -

Decided to go with EMC9 because it claimed it could "Capture HD Video with the latest Camcorders"

I'm using a Sony HDR-SR1 HD hard disk camcorder.
This is what I've found so far -
CinePlayer seems to work - it probably would help if I had a faster CPU (I'm using a 1.9GHz P4)
The capture program doesn't recognize the camcorder - no options to capture from it are presented. Not too worried about this, since the Sony program works fine.

The problem is -
VideoWave will attempt to load a .m2ts file, but claims it has to convert it first. After selecting where to save the file, it reports back "Error building graph."

Ideas?

[ggrussell]

What video card do you have? If you read the MINIMUM requirements is a video card that supports DirectX 9.0c. Some older cards may have updated drivers, but they don't fully support the commands.

As for high definition, what are you're expectations? Without a Blueray or HD DVD burner and a HDTV set/Player, you won't be getting full HD quality. EMC9 does support HD DivX and HD WMV file output, but again, you will need the proper hardware to play those back.

In all other cases, the HD video will be converted to standard definition to comply with the video DVD standard.

[buck]

ggrussell, on Nov 11 2006, 07:04 PM, said:

What video card do you have? If you read the MINIMUM requirements is a video card that supports DirectX 9.0c. Some older cards may have updated drivers, but they don't fully support the commands.

As for high definition, what are you're expectations? Without a Blueray or HD DVD burner and a HDTV set/Player, you won't be getting full HD quality. EMC9 does support HD DivX and HD WMV file output, but again, you will need the proper hardware to play those back.

In all other cases, the HD video will be converted to standard definition to comply with the video DVD standard.

I have an ATI All-in-wonder Radeon 8500. so that may be part of the problem with the video speed, along with the slow CPU. Would that cause the "Error building graph" problem?

My expectation was to be able to edit an HD movie on my computer, and then dump it to a Blueray DVD, or even back to the camera.

I'd settle for downconverting it to SD and editing that for now.

[ggrussell]

That card was manufacturer sometime in 2002 so was probably designed for a much earlier version of DirectX (7 or 8) so it will not fully support DirectX9. Try updating the ATI drivers. That may allow you to render in the software mode.

EMC 9 does support buring to Blueray, but I don't think it supports sending the video back to a hard drive based camcorder. I would have to do some research on the native format of the Sony HDR-SR1. I would assume it uses MPEG 4. You might be able to 'output to file' from Videowave and then transfer those files back to the camcorder.

[Melachrino]

Hello. I tried a similar scenario to test EMC9 performance in HDV and AVCHD, which the package and lit said it could handle.

Videowave 9 did not handle a AVCHD .m2ts file saying " Error building graph". AVCHD is supposed to be H.254 or commonly referred to as MPG4.

Videowave 9 did recognize, load and handle an HDV .m2t file both from a website (test file) and from a Sony HDR-HC3 camcorder, both in direct play and from a pre-recorded HD tape.

However, when I tried to put back a short, simply edited (in VW9) version of the camcorder clip into the tape, the options menu in WV9 were very confusing. There was only one entry which would qualify as HD and was " 1920 by 1080" and "interlace" option. The Sony camcorder is rated at 1040x1080 i.

Making that selection, nothing happened. Tried others, with no results either.

Sony HDR-HC3 manual says that HD video can be loaded to tape from PC, therefore, I am sure that I am doing something wrong with VW9. What ?

Would appreciate any help.

[ggrussell]

Melachrino, on Nov 16 2006, 06:55 PM, said:

Videowave 9 did not handle a AVCHD .m2ts file saying " Error building graph".

That is a video card error. Make sure yo have the latest DirectX (oct 2006) and updated video card drivers.

Since the camcorder is only 1040X1080i which sounds like 4:3 and not 16:9, you may have to use the software that came with your camcorder to transfer files back to it.

[Melachrino]

ggrussell, on Nov 17 2006, 02:50 PM, said:

That is a video card error. Make sure yo have the latest DirectX (oct 2006) and updated video card drivers.

Since the camcorder is only 1040X1080i which sounds like 4:3 and not 16:9, you may have to use the software that came with your camcorder to transfer files back to it.

Sorry, my spelling error. Obviously for an HD Sony Camera the actual pixels are 1440x1080.

Will try your suggested DirectX update and report.

Thanks.

[ggrussell]

Thanks for the correction, but still rather odd number since 1080i should be 1920X1080.

Videowave/MyDVD 9 require a much better video card than earlier versions. Most laptops and computers that have video on the motherboard, usually do not fully support DirectX 9 and is highly recommended to buy a separate card.

[Melachrino]

ggrussell, on Nov 17 2006, 05:19 PM, said:

Thanks for the correction, but still rather odd number since 1080i should be 1920X1080.

Videowave/MyDVD 9 require a much better video card than earlier versions. Most laptops and computers that have video on the motherboard, usually do not fully support DirectX 9 and is highly recommended to buy a separate card.

I tried your suggestion to update DirectX to the latest version (October 2006). That did not fix previewing or loading AVCHD test files (.m2ts) into VW9. HDV test files (.m2t) continued to preview and load satisfactorily in VW9.

As you well say, the MPEG2 HDTV standard (for the US) is 1920x1080 for the interlaced option. The 1440x1080i is the resolution rating, not the scanning rating, of the Sony HDR-HC3 and HDR-SR1 camcorders. Not quite full HD but close and honest. The professional HD cameras do resolve the full 1920 horizontal.

My video card is NVIDIA GeForce 4 MX440 and updated to latest. Since with VW9 it handles correctly the HDV files, rated at 25MBs, but does not show or handle AVCHD files, rated at 15MBs, would it not appear that the problem is with the decoder rather than the graphics ? After all, once the decoder rasterizes the file, the graphics card just displays the information and refreshes as the decoder tells it to. Question, not a statement.

[ggrussell]

Since .m2ts is an extension recognized by Videowave, looks like it would handle them properly. The graph building error usually has something to do with the video card. The Geforce 4 should support DirectX 9, but there are so many models that I have no idea if the MX440 FULLY supports it. May be time for a new video card.

[kenw]

I'm a little slow on the uptake so my questions are:
1. Can one edit AVCHD with EMC 8 or 9?
2. What is the suggested graphics card to do so?
3. Once the edits have been made, how does one output the product? Back to the camcorder to show on an HD TV? Or does one need a blu ray DVD burner and player....or an HDV burner and player?
4. What good is it to have an HD camcorder if the video cannot be manipulated and shown?
5. I'd love to buy an SR1 but am I wrong in assuming it might be a little too early?

[grandpabruce]

buck, on Nov 11 2006, 10:00 PM, said:

I have an ATI All-in-wonder Radeon 8500. so that may be part of the problem with the video speed, along with the slow CPU. Would that cause the "Error building graph" problem?

My expectation was to be able to edit an HD movie on my computer, and then dump it to a Blueray DVD, or even back to the camera.

I'd settle for downconverting it to SD and editing that for now.

The 8500 will work, but you are better off getting a better video card. I used the 8500 Pro (no AIW) on my backup machine, and EMC 9 ran, but had a glitch or 2, every once in awhile.

I threw in my 9800 pro, and it works flawlessly.

This post has been edited by grandpabruce: 25 November 2006 - 05:50 AM

[ggrussell]

You should be able to edit the HDV in EMC9. However, you may be out of luck sending edited files back to the camcorder with Videowave. The DCR-SR series uses USB 2 to transfer files. I'm fairly sure that Videowave only supports transfer back to the camcorder using Firewire and the SR camcorders don't have both. But you should be able to output to MPEG 4 file and then use Sony's software to transfer it back to the camcorder.

Personally, I think you're last statement is more correct. HD editing at this point is in its early stages. Wait 6 months to a year and we'll see much better support for the camcorders and the file formats.

[Melachrino]

ggrussell, on Nov 25 2006, 06:50 AM, said:

You should be able to edit the HDV in EMC9. However, you may be out of luck sending edited files back to the camcorder with Videowave. The DCR-SR series uses USB 2 to transfer files. I'm fairly sure that Videowave only supports transfer back to the camcorder using Firewire and the SR camcorders don't have both. But you should be able to output to MPEG 4 file and then use Sony's software to transfer it back to the camcorder.

Personally, I think you're last statement is more correct. HD editing at this point is in its early stages. Wait 6 months to a year and we'll see much better support for the camcorders and the file formats.

Regrettably, it seems that your last comment is quite correct at this point. I have not found anybody in other forums who has been able to move original or edited HDV and AVCHD files back to either of the Sony camcorders HC3 or SR1 respectively. I just spent a couple of days at the local major electronic stores with their resident gurus with hands on attempts to transfer pertinent files and live shots back to their cameras for viewing in true large screen HD TV sets. HDV files were recognized and could be edited in VW9. AVCHD were not. Yet both types of cameras could play directly, and impressively, into said TV sets.

The HC3 camera has firewire, as you well point out, and it transfers video TO the PC quite well in HD whether from tape or live. But, the chagrin is that no one seems to know how to transfer those HD files back to the camera in HD. DV is no problem, but why would I want to do that with an HD camera ? My trusty old DV corder can do that perfectly well.

[automation]

Hi Melachrino or anyone else that can help.
Melachrino you have a sony hdr hc3. I also have one but i'm having problems getting it to be detected. mine is detected and shows in hardware manager as AV/C TAPE DEVICE but nothing appears in my computer. In normal sd dv mode it's detected as a sony camcorder and appears in my computer and software. I was expexting similar in hd mode.
can you tell me is this correct.
if so i need to look at em9 and avid not detecting but if not windows or the camera are the problem
regards Tony

[ggrussell]

automation, on Dec 29 2006, 09:36 AM, said:

In normal sd dv mode it's detected as a sony camcorder and appears in my computer and software. I was expexting similar in hd mode.

Unfortunately, that is not going to happen. In SD DV mode, the camcorder uses DV AVI just like any other miniDV camcorder on the market and Windows recognizes it as such. In AVCHD mode, it uses a totally different codec. You will need to use the software that came with the camcoder to transfer these files. At this point, I don't know of any other software that supports this file type capture.

[automation]

the hdr hc3 dosent come with any sofware surly avid should capture from the camera.
I've heard this software can work though
http://home.earthlin...pDVHS_0306a.zip

[automation]

Has any one got HDR HC3 ???? what I'm trying to establish is what the pc should detect the camera as so I can rule in or out the detection of the camera as the problem. It seems odd that it detects it as a generic device. "avc tape" Avid HD does not have a option for this. roxio dosn't either

[ggrussell]

automation, on Dec 30 2006, 03:46 AM, said:

Has any one got HDR HC3 ???? what I'm trying to establish is what the pc should detect the camera as so I can rule in or out the detection of the camera as the problem.

Perhaps Sony support would be a better place to ask that question.

[pfcurtis]

Perhaps Sony support would be a better place to ask that question.

I realize that the last post to this thread was months ago but the problem with AVCHD is still there. Panasonic has released a camcorder with the same file format. Here is a link to a forum that may help explain some of the problems and some possible solutions:
http://www.worldtv.com/blog/technology/rev...es_of_avchd.php

Do you ever get any feedback from Roxio on this forum? What is their estimate when EMC, especially Videowave, will add the neccessary codec to read this file format?