16 replies to this topic

[dand47]

Have made several different DVD's over the last few years and this is first time for this problem.  I edit on an XP machine in Adobe Premiere 6.5 and export with Adobe/Matrox Media Export to an MPG2 file.  The drop out is a stuttering, drop in volume and out of sync problem.  Each occurrence is only 1 or 2 seconds long and happens in coincidence with a transition either from video to a still image or from still to still.  I went back to adobe and changed the cut transitions to cross dissolves but it made no difference.  I made a disc image and transferred it from my XP desktop to my Vista laptop and burned a DVD on the Vista but had same problem.  I have burned four different discs all have the same problem.  There is no problem when the AVI is played from the timeline in Adobe or if I play the MPG2 file in Windows Media Player or when I play in preview mode in EMC9.  Problem shows up after the MPG2 file is burned as a DVD.

[sknis]

Have made several different DVD's over the last few years and this is first time for this problem.  I edit on an XP machine in Adobe Premiere 6.5 and export with Adobe/Matrox Media Export to an MPG2 file.  The drop out is a stuttering, drop in volume and out of sync problem.  Each occurrence is only 1 or 2 seconds long and happens in coincidence with a transition either from video to a still image or from still to still.  I went back to adobe and changed the cut transitions to cross dissolves but it made no difference.  I made a disc image and transferred it from my XP desktop to my Vista laptop and burned a DVD on the Vista but had same problem.  I have burned four different discs all have the same problem.  There is no problem when the AVI is played from the timeline in Adobe or if I play the MPG2 file in Windows Media Player or when I play in preview mode in EMC9.  Problem shows up after the MPG2 file is burned as a DVD.

Have you tried a different DVD player; perhaps yours is going bad or just doesn't like the discs you are using.

What is the make of the blank DVDs you are using?
I'm not clear on what you are doing.  If you make the mpg2 file and put into Video Wave and play that, do you see any issues?  
If you burn that mpg2 to an image file in My DVD or DVD Builder and copy that to a RW, do you see the issue?  

Mount a virtual drive and add that ISO file.  How does it play on your computer? If the ISO file plays on your computer without a problem, that pretty much limits the issue to the discs you are using or the player.

[dand47]

Have you tried a different DVD player; perhaps yours is going bad or just doesn't like the discs you are using.

What is the make of the blank DVDs you are using?
I'm not clear on what you are doing.  If you make the mpg2 file and put into Video Wave and play that, do you see any issues?  
If you burn that mpg2 to an image file in My DVD or DVD Builder and copy that to a RW, do you see the issue?  

Mount a virtual drive and add that ISO file.  How does it play on your computer? If the ISO file plays on your computer without a problem, that pretty much limits the issue to the discs you are using or the player.

Thanks for your quick response and help.

I tried in another DVD player with same result.  I also played in Media Center on my laptop.  Only stuttered in one of the four spots and not as bad.  In Windows Media Player on my desktop it stuttered in two places.

The DVD's are Memorex +R's.

The mpg2 file plays perfect in Video Wave.  It will also play in WMP.

Can I copy an ISO file to disc then play it or do I need the "virtual drive" thing?

How/what "mount a virtual drive"?

You made the statement "I'm not clear on what you are doing".  Is there a better way other than the mpg2 route.  Would I be better creating an AVI file (less compression) and importing that into MyDVD.

Thanks.

[myguggi]

Thanks for your quick response and help.

I tried in another DVD player with same result.  I also played in Media Center on my laptop.  Only stuttered in one of the four spots and not as bad.  In Windows Media Player on my desktop it stuttered in two places.

The DVD's are Memorex +R's.

The mpg2 file plays perfect in Video Wave.  It will also play in WMP.

Can I copy an ISO file to disc then play it or do I need the "virtual drive" thing?

How/what "mount a virtual drive"?

You made the statement "I'm not clear on what you are doing".  Is there a better way other than the mpg2 route.  Would I be better creating an AVI file (less compression) and importing that into MyDVD.

Thanks.

The DVDs you are using are considered by many as poor quality disc, get some good quality such as Verbatims.

If you first "burn" to an iso file you can then burn the iso file to DVD. That separates the encoding and burning process and seems to give better result

[dand47]

The DVDs you are using are considered by many as poor quality disc, get some good quality such as Verbatims.

If you first "burn" to an iso file you can then burn the iso file to DVD. That separates the encoding and burning process and seems to give better result

Thank you again for your assistance.

So an iso file cannot be played directly as I understood from you post.  I usually do make an iso file then use that to burn copies.  

As for Verbatim.  I am in a friendly (so for) war with them over two 50 packs of printable dvd's.  The ink will not dry when printed.  This war has gone on for 4 months and is about to get heated.  I have used a lot of memorex with no problem.  And this problem only shows up with that one 30 minute file and always in exactly the same four spots so I doubt a disk problem.

I created an avi file instead of mpg2 and it worked with no problem.  But when I try to add the other two files to the same DVD, EMC9 indicates the I have max'ed out the capacity of the disk.  So I assume when a dvd is created by EMC it does not compress the original file but instead uses what I load up and just adds menus.  As you can see I am a little lacking on the how these programs work.

I just made two DVD's, one RW and one write only, both work.  I used the avi file to replace the problem mpg2 and the other two files are mpg2.  It works on both DVD's.  Still don't know what original problem was but at least I have something that works.

Thanks for you help.

[myguggi]

Thank you again for your assistance.

So an iso file cannot be played directly as I understood from you post.  I usually do make an iso file then use that to burn copies.  

As for Verbatim.  I am in a friendly (so for) war with them over two 50 packs of printable dvd's.  The ink will not dry when printed.  This war has gone on for 4 months and is about to get heated.  I have used a lot of memorex with no problem.  And this problem only shows up with that one 30 minute file and always in exactly the same four spots so I doubt a disk problem.

I created an avi file instead of mpg2 and it worked with no problem.  But when I try to add the other two files to the same DVD, EMC9 indicates the I have max'ed out the capacity of the disk.  So I assume when a dvd is created by EMC it does not compress the original file but instead uses what I load up and just adds menus.  As you can see I am a little lacking on the how these programs work.

I just made two DVD's, one RW and one write only, both work.  I used the avi file to replace the problem mpg2 and the other two files are mpg2.  It works on both DVD's.  Still don't know what original problem was but at least I have something that works.

Thanks for you help.

I am not sure why you created an avi file from the mpg file since it will be rendered back to mpg2 again when you create your DVD

If you maxed out your DVD it means that your movie is too long. A 4.7GB DVD can only hold 60 minutes of video at best quality. Any more and the video has to be compressed with loss of quality of course.

[dand47]

I am not sure why you created an avi file from the mpg file since it will be rendered back to mpg2 again when you create your DVD

If you maxed out your DVD it means that your movie is too long. A 4.7GB DVD can only hold 60 minutes of video at best quality. Any more and the video has to be compressed with loss of quality of course.

I did not create the avi from the mpg2.  I created it in Adobe Premiere from my edited video.  I have several options within Adobe which include avi and mpg2.  Evidently EMC9 didn't like something in the Adobe created mpg2 but worked when EMC9 created the mpg2.  Whatever, it worked with the avi.

I am able to put close to 90 minutes of video on the 4.7GB DVD at what EMC9 indicates is HQ.  My first attempt at this project (with all mpg2 files) had more (~90 minutes) on it than I was able to put on it when I used the avi file for the first 30 minutes of the DVD.  And the first project had several minutes left over but the last only had a 92.7MB or 1 minute left according to EMC9.  Does it mean I am getting the best quality when I have HQ selected and EMC9 says it will fit.

Again, thanks for your help in this matter.

[myguggi]

I did not create the avi from the mpg2.  I created it in Adobe Premiere from my edited video.  I have several options within Adobe which include avi and mpg2.  Evidently EMC9 didn't like something in the Adobe created mpg2 but worked when EMC9 created the mpg2.  Whatever, it worked with the avi.

I am able to put close to 90 minutes of video on the 4.7GB DVD at what EMC9 indicates is HQ.  My first attempt at this project (with all mpg2 files) had more (~90 minutes) on it than I was able to put on it when I used the avi file for the first 30 minutes of the DVD.  And the first project had several minutes left over but the last only had a 92.7MB or 1 minute left according to EMC9.  Does it mean I am getting the best quality when I have HQ selected and EMC9 says it will fit.

Again, thanks for your help in this matter.

Sorry about the part about "creating an avi fro mpegs", a misread on my part

You cannot put 90 minutes of video at HQ quality on a standard 4.7GB DVD. If you "squeezed" 90 minutes on the DVD then it was at one of the quality settings that gives lower quality. It does not matter if you use avi, mpeg2 or wmv files: they all get encoded to DVD mpeg2 video.

[dand47]

Sorry about the part about "creating an avi fro mpegs", a misread on my part

You cannot put 90 minutes of video at HQ quality on a standard 4.7GB DVD. If you "squeezed" 90 minutes on the DVD then it was at one of the quality settings that gives lower quality. It does not matter if you use avi, mpeg2 or wmv files: they all get encoded to DVD mpeg2 video.

Thanks for educating me on how DVD authoring works.

But I'm still a little confused with what you are telling me and what I see when working with EMC9.  The DVD I just finished has three seperate videos on it.  The time of each is 0:29:48:28, 0:36:27:21 and 0:27:15:09 for a total of over 93 minutes.  I have HQ selected for the quality setting.  EMC says there is 92.7MB free and when I look at the burned disk the burned area measures 4.45 inches in diameter.  This is with the first file being an avi loaded into the project before EMC makes it an mpg2 and the other two being mpg2 loaded into the project.  

On disks where all three were mpg2 loaded into the project the burned area only measures 4.1 inches and these disks actually had 4 or 5 minutes extra material on them.  Again, EMC9 indicated HQ.

On a disk where I only burned the first video, the 0:29:48:28 long one, it burned 2.8 inches on the disk.

On a different 59 minute project the burned area of the disk measured 3.5 inches, again at HQ according to EMC9.

These are all 4.7GB disks.

Can I depend on the video actually being HQ quality when EMC9 indicates HQ even though I am putting up to 90 minutes on the disk?  I have not noticed a difference in playback between short projects and ones that run over 60 minutes.

When I load an mpg2 into an EMC9 project, does it use that file as is or does it do more compression.

Sorry for all this info but I want to understand how best to use EMC and still get as much on a DVD as possible.

[sknis]

  You are the first person that actually measured the burn distance and try to equate it to anything !  By the way, you are missing the bit rate factor.

For best results, select encode to an ISO file or to a folder set when you select burn in My DVD (DVD Builder/Create DVD).  Uncheck the other options. When that is finished, copy the ISO for folder set to a DVD using Creator Classic.  The will make the project just fit on a disc at the best possible quality.  If you burn directly to disc from MyDVD, it sometimes lowers the quality (bit rate) and gives you space left over.

Why do you want to squeeze as much onto a disc as possible?  That was OK when discs were expensive but now now.  

Do not try to get more than 2 hours and a little bit on the disc unless you use the folder option.  You may be able to get slightly less than 2 hours on a disc at a much reduced quality.  You will have to make your own judgment.   If you try to get more as a direct burn or as an ISO file, the end of the videos may be cut off.

Edited by sknis, 23 December 2009 - 07:59 AM.

[Larry]

I can guess why you were probably able to get the 90+ min on the disc even tho you had it set at HQ.

You mentioned that 2 of the files you used were already mpeg2 files. One thing that MyDVD will do, when you use mpeg2 files in your project that are already DVD-Video compliant, is it will usually not re-encode them.

So those 2 files, while they were mpeg2 ones, probably had bitrates etc that were less than what the HQ setting uses. Probably closer to what the SP ones are.

So my guess is that MyDVD didn't re-encode those 2. Just used them "as is". Which would be a good thing, since the more times an mpeg2 file gets re-encoded, the more the quality will degrade, no matter what the settings. And also because you can't encode a file to a higher quality than it is to start with.

[Jim_Hardin]

I can guess why you were probably able to get the 90+ min on the disc even tho you had it set at HQ.

You mentioned that 2 of the files you used were already mpeg2 files. One thing that MyDVD will do, when you use mpeg2 files in your project that are already DVD-Video compliant, is it will usually not re-encode them.

So those 2 files, while they were mpeg2 ones, probably had bitrates etc that were less than what the HQ setting uses. Probably closer to what the SP ones are.

So my guess is that MyDVD didn't re-encode those 2. Just used them "as is". Which would be a good thing, since the more times an mpeg2 file gets re-encoded, the more the quality will degrade, no matter what the settings. And also because you can't encode a file to a higher quality than it is to start with.

No it does not work that way.

They would be re-rendered to the bit rate that was selected. All Roxio products use constant bit rates, so the mpegs would not be "compliant" when you select a Quality setting that is not a match.

My bet – Fit to Disc or SP was what was actually selected. It would not work if HQ was selected.

[Larry]

No it does not work that way.

They would be re-rendered to the bit rate that was selected. All Roxio products use constant bit rates, so the mpegs would not be "compliant" when you select a Quality setting that is not a match.

My bet – Fit to Disc or SP was what was actually selected. It would not work if HQ was selected.

Well it has worked that way for me in each version going back to EMC 9. I can take mpeg2 files that have a lower bitrate than the HQ settings, use the HQ default, and it will do the "smart rendering" (not re-encode them). The only time they have gotten re-encoded is if I have the project settings set to Progressive or Interlaced and the source files are the other.

[Jim_Hardin]

Well it has worked that way for me in each version going back to EMC 9. I can take mpeg2 files that have a lower bitrate than the HQ settings, use the HQ default, and it will do the "smart rendering" (not re-encode them). The only time they have gotten re-encoded is if I have the project settings set to Progressive or Interlaced and the source files are the other.

So you can duplicate getting 90 minutes on a 4.7 DVD with render set at HQ - direct burn?

Don't think so...

[Jim_Hardin]

OK, I tried it – Don't work! Won't work! Can't possibly work!

I rendered a 90 minute mpg at 4mbps.

Opened MyDVD 9 and added that file:



Burn is based on Time and when set to HQ available time is 1:05 minutes and nothing can change that!

[Larry]

Well it has worked for me. I've added screen shots of the file in Win Explorer, what GSpot reports about the file, and how it looks in MyDVD in c2009 depending on the Interlaced/Progressive setting.

I would have used EMC 9, but I do not have that loaded on a pc that I have access too at the moment (with the holiday it may be a while before I can if you really want me to). However, I know that it behaved the exact same way in EMC 9 as this is the file that I have used to test with in each of the MyDVD versions to see if it can be used without getting re-rendered. And EMC 9 was the version that I first burned this to a disc to add to our video library.

So as I stated earlier, if the 2 mpeg files the OP was using were not re-rendered, only the avi file was, then it is possible that that is why they were able to see the results they did with fitting 90 mins on a disc.

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[dand47]

Wow, I am learning a lot from this discussion, thanks,

The reason I reported the burn area of the disk was to hopefully give you some useful info - maybe its not.

You ask why I want to squeeze all I can get on a disk.  What I want first is best quality, and second to get all of one project on one disk if possible.  I assumed if the EMC 9 quality was set to HQ (not "fit to disk") and I had room left I was good to go.  Is this true or not?

You mention bitrates.  Below is the info from Matrox Mediaexport on the mpg2 files I export from Adobe Premiere 6.5.  As you probably know Matrox is an add-on to adobe.  Is this a good fit for EMC 9 or would I be better exporting avi files from Adobe and letting EMC 9 encode them.  I am looking for best quality because the new flat screen tv's sure show any flaws.
    Matrox info:
    For creating DVD-quality, variable bit rate video, using simple VBR mode (multiplexed).

    Video:
    MPEG-2 elementary
    720x480; 29.97 fps; VBR average 4500 Kbps; Sequence header before every GOP.

    Audio:
    MPEG audio layer II
   48 kHz; 16-bit; Stereo; 384 Kbps

    Motion Estimation: 16

Thanks for the help and information.