work on VISTA Premium

[spadasal]

good mornig from Italy.

 

The Easy M.C.Suite 9 is compatible with VISTA-Premium?

Thank you - by

[gi7omy]

OK - first point: neither Bruce, myself or any of the others work for or are paid by Roxio in any manner. Roxio staff (when they do visit here) are identified by a Roxio icon at their name.

 

Development of Vista? EMC9 did work with Vista in development. What happened was that MS released a zero day patch (on the day of the Vista launch) which messed up EMC9. This was down to MICROSOFT and NOT Roxio.

 

Microsoft are an even bigger company - but they managed to put a Vista update out that effectively wrecked an app that was originally compatible, so you tell me whose fault THAT was.

 

Roxio are working on a fix for that, but instead of rushing a fix out for one app in the suite, they are working with MS in getting the entire suite certified. Now, which would you prefer - a part of the suite that is certified and a large chunk that isn't or the entire suite fixed and certified?

 

As for Vista itself - there are a LOT of apps and hardware that work well with XP but will NOT work with Vista, and not just Roxio

[gi7omy]

Please explain what part of "...the patch released on the day of the official release messed up part of EMC9 - again stated by MS..." is so hard to fathom?

 

Roxio are working on this WITH Microsoft in order to resolve it. Changes WERE made to the kernel at the official release date. The earlier releases did not have those until the end of January but they did cause the damage.

 

As far as anyone here knows, the intention is now to get all parts of EMC9 certified by MS - not just one part now and another again but ALL of it. That is going to take time and won't happen overnight

[Atomic_Ed]

The release last year was OEM - NOT the actual release. That's is a fact as stated by MS

 

Also, the patch released on the day of the official release messed up part of EMC9 - again stated by MS

 

So you feel that Microsoft can do no wrong - even when they actually ADMIT it?

The release in November I was referring to was not just OEM but also actual MS select licensing for Business customers. At our company we have been able to purchase final release Vista since November 2006. OEM software you mention is for system builders like HP, Dell, Etc. These are two different things.

 

Please don't take my comments as defending MS, which is not my intention. Of course MS can do wrong and routinely does in many cases, IMO, I was just stating that the FINAL release of Vista has been for over 4 months now. My disappointement with EMC9 is that it is now mid March and still no patch from Roxio has been release to resolve the issues. Uninstalling MS recommended or critical updates, is not a viable workaround. So I do understand that Roxio was impacted by an MS update which is no fault of theirs, but letting it go on for so long now without a patch is.

 

Other smaller software companies with products I purchased that advertised upcoming Vista support for their productslast year, all work with Vista fine or have put out updates expeditiously after an issue was reported.

 

I suppose this is a very touchy subject here for some, but keep in mind I am rooting for Roxio to do something and not trying to attack them. However if no one ever states or mentions how they feel about the way a company handles their customers, then none of us ever has a right to complain when things are not so good. It is our feedbacks and feelings about these things that can be constructive for everyone. Not only for the customer but for the company to have some insight on how their customers feel about the decisions and directions they choose. I feel rather than stating my opinions and feelings here being a negative thing, they are in fact a positive when looked at constructively.

 

Think about it, I am sure Roxio desires to make the best choices they can to properly support their customers while at the same time maintaining profitibility and growth. I think in the end they would appreciate hearing these things. I did not post here aggressively or defamatory as some do that are venting, just honestly how I feel about the handling of the issues. I have been a long time repeat Roxio / Sonic customer and hope to continue that but if their business decisions are negatively impacting my ability to effectively make use of the software I purchase from them, well then I must make a decision to either put up with it or find an alternative product that better suits my needs. I think before I were to make this choice without saying a word or letting them know I feel, then I would not be fair to them to give a chance to make positive changes with future releases or internal decision making processes.

 

Anyway I hope the good people here can understand I am not her to bash anyone but things are what they are and without a voice can't be expected to change for the better.

[gi7omy]

The release last year was OEM - NOT the actual release. That's is a fact as stated by MS

 

Also, the patch released on the day of the official release messed up part of EMC9 - again stated by MS

 

So you feel that Microsoft can do no wrong - even when they actually ADMIT it?

[Atomic_Ed]

Atomic Ed said: Agreed, again to some extent, as if this were a typical OS release time cycle then yes I could see yourpoint. But as this release cycle has gone on years past any other previous OS release and again the release of xp x64 years ago now, there is simply no excuse iMO for this type of inadequate support after Vista is now the current MS OS and has been final release now for around 6 months if you include the business select license people. I will further say that in addition, how can it be explained that there are other vendors seeling similar software that works under Vista from the relese day? I am well aware of the issues with Nero and Roxio in the burning software segment but what about NTI and Cyberlink products that do work well from what I am reading? This to me seems silly since both of these are obscure in this segment in comparison to Roxio and Ahead with I would imagine far less resources behind them

 

Vista was released to the general public sometime in late January or early February. Your argument would carry more weight, if you used facts.

 

I was referring to the OFFICIAL business customers relase of Vista which was 11-2006. I apologize for being off by a few months where I should have said 4 months not 6. I was thinking the business relase was in September but it was November as I stand corrected. However business customers can and do use Roxio EMC as well.

 

The home user availability OFFICIAL release for Vista was 1-30-2007, I know because I purchased it and installed it that day myself.

 

Sorry if I was unclear in any way, I have no desire to intentionally state anything that is not factual, but these are the facts and any weight in reference to my statements on this matter, will be with those who chose to see them for what they are. Anyone can take details out of context to bolster or discredit a viewpoint of belief, however as I mentioned I am not here trying to knock Roxio or EMC9, just expressing my views and disappointment with the way things have been handled in reference to Vista support.

[grandpabruce]

Atomic Ed said: Agreed, again to some extent, as if this were a typical OS release time cycle then yes I could see yourpoint. But as this release cycle has gone on years past any other previous OS release and again the release of xp x64 years ago now, there is simply no excuse iMO for this type of inadequate support after Vista is now the current MS OS and has been final release now for around 6 months if you include the business select license people. I will further say that in addition, how can it be explained that there are other vendors seeling similar software that works under Vista from the relese day? I am well aware of the issues with Nero and Roxio in the burning software segment but what about NTI and Cyberlink products that do work well from what I am reading? This to me seems silly since both of these are obscure in this segment in comparison to Roxio and Ahead with I would imagine far less resources behind them

 

Vista was released to the general public sometime in late January or early February. Your argument would carry more weight, if you used facts.

[Atomic_Ed]

To Atomic Ed. Not going to quote as it would be too long.

 

What came first....the Chicken or the Egg? ;-)

 

Not sure as I never figured out an answer for that one..

 

I know Vista has been in development for a long time.........I know Roxio and all the other software developers have tried to be ready.

 

I believe this to some extent, as some companies seem to have tried to band aid existing products to work with Vista. I believe this is true, but it is still not an excuse for true ground up development or code modifications to properly support a major replacement OS. Additionally it is somewhat strange that some software products in various categories were fully Vista functional the day of the Business release months ago and work beautifully. Yet others have fundemental functionality issues with Vista even including the installers. Some of the products I am referring to are important ones to me and are applications such as Mcafee AV, Ulead Video Studio 10, Acronis True Image 10, and a few others, allof which work just fine under my Vista installs. EMC9 was the only application I owned that I can not get to run under Vista. Based on the forums here and other sites I have visited on the net, it is not surprising as so many are having issues with EMC9 and Vista.

 

My arguement is that, and this is no gripe against MS as I believe I understand what they are faced with, no matter how much they test, prepare, beta etc. etc. etc., there are going to be issues to resolve. I ask you, have you ever seen ANY OS released that didn't have some things to be worked out, a time lag for compatible drivers and on and on?

 

Agreed, again to some extent, as if this were a typical OS release time cycle then yes I could see yourpoint. But as this release cycle has gone on years past any other previous OS release and again the release of xp x64 years ago now, there is simply no excuse iMO for this type of inadequate support after Vista is now the current MS OS and has been final release now for around 6 months if you include the business select license people. I will further say that in addition, how can it be explained that there are other vendors seeling similar software that works under Vista from the relese day? I am well aware of the issues with Nero and Roxio in the burning software segment but what about NTI and Cyberlink products that do work well from what I am reading? This to me seems silly since both of these are obscure in this segment in comparison to Roxio and Ahead with I would imagine far less resources behind them.

 

It's just like a new model year for a car purchase or new model purchase of anything, there are going to be things to be worked out, fixed and changed once the initial release of a suppossedly "finalized" version is released for public "consumption".

 

All the manufacturers, including MS, even have this period of working out the bugs, fixes and updates in the budget. They know it's going to happen..........why shouldn't we expect it.

 

Again I refer to my earlier statement on the extended release cycle of this OS as well as the previously released for business users last year. Also while I can certainly understand a last minute change by MS could have messed up a driver or such, the amount of recovery time from a company to correct this should not take months. Especially a company with alot of resources and such a large installed user base.

If I expect it, then my logic tells me to WAIT UNTIL this period is over so I don't have to go through the headaches. That's my reasoning and it has served me well.

 

Again, there are much smaller vendors who have Vista compatible products that work and work now since release. I am not sayng they are perfect but they don't have fundemental issues that prevent using them under Vista like some do.

 

By all means, if you want it.......go get it. But be ready for the inevitable "pains" that come with CHANGE.

 

Well I have gotten it and as I mentioned have it on 3 machines now all of which run all my other current applications wonderfully and without a single glitch so far. The exception to this is my EMC9 which will not work under my Vista install. You know in fact so far I am very impressed with how well Vista runs and the appearance is light years ahead of XP. You can really see the difference in how dated XP looks once you run Vista for awhile. I have XP Pro at the office and every morning I come and and look at the desktop it just looks old to me now in comparison. Then again all the years XP has been stretched out it is not surprising and overall for an OS to have lasted this long is pretty amazing in itself. So XP IMO was actually pretty advanced back in the day.

 

I want Vista too as it has a lot to offer.........but I will wait until the chageover is complete and fixed, software developers, drivers and hardware have caught up. Then I will rush right out and get it.

 

I think if you work with Vista for even a short time you will never look back at XP. You will definately appreciate the interface improvements and how smoothe it runs. Of course I will put the DRM junk part of it aside from what I am saying but what can we do about that anyway? I don't know what all the applcation you run are or how well youmight find alternatives at this stage for Vista, but I can tell you that in my case the only application I don't currently have for my Vista is a cd & dvd burning app that works. Everything else from video editing, anti-virus-firewall-antispam, disk imaging, etc all work great. The best part is that I purchased all of those apps awhile back based on the manufacturers advertising upcoming Vista support in their products. I actually upgraded my EMC8 because of the bullet in the ad for 9 that said Vista support, but it turned out the only app not working properly under Vista that I had was EMC9. I suppose that is not too bad as it is the only app I have an issue with but the length of time to resolve this is making me consider other alternatives. Not have a burning app sine January 30 is not too fun since it is now mid March. I am forced to burn everything I need to burn under Linux until I can get resolution for burning under Vista. I am considering NTI or Cyberlink burning programs if Roxio doesn't get a patch out soon. Both of which are rated to run pretty good under Vista right now.

 

I would like to say that I hope no one takes my posting as trying to knock Roxio or EMC9 as I do personally like the product and company. I also hold multiple license for their products and was a Sonic customer for years as well. But truly I am disappointed at the result / status of the product compatibility, so long after the Vista official release. To me it just doesn't make sense given the amount of time they had, the resources they have and the amount of installed users out there. I see someone posted something about a ver 10 made for Vista being the answer to this and I am starting to wonder if this is not going to be the case in the end.

[Larry]

OK I have heard this one before. I was at the final developers launch conference in November and there was nothing changed after that (other than those done as a result of the normal update process and most of those were UAC). I don't know who started this zero day patch story but I have read something similar to it before. I don't know where you got it from but it isn't true AND if it was true all hell would have broken loose amongst a very active developer partner community. Perhaps somebody at Roxio told you this?

 

I still have my money on Version 10 "Made for Vista"

 

Let's all hope I'm wrong

Well, I for one think you are. Roxio has a KB article about the error MS made in one of their "Critical Updates" that were put out the same day as the Public release of Vista. Those that installed Vista from the original discs sold but did not update from MS site, had no problems. Those that updated Vista from MS site did. I don;t care what it was called, Zero Day patch, update, hotfix, doesn't matter. That's all symantics. Bottom line, MS made an error in an update that caused problems with part of EMC 9.

[crhendo]

OK - first point: neither Bruce, myself or any of the others work for or are paid by Roxio in any manner. Roxio staff (when they do visit here) are identified by a Roxio icon at their name.

 

OK I have heard this one before. I was at the final developers launch conference in November and there was nothing changed after that (other than those done as a result of the normal update process and most of those were UAC). I don't know who started this zero day patch story but I have read something similar to it before. I don't know where you got it from but it isn't true AND if it was true all hell would have broken loose amongst a very active developer partner community. Perhaps somebody at Roxio told you this?

 

I still have my money on Version 10 "Made for Vista"

 

Let's all hope I'm wrong

[FwFdfireman]

To Atomic Ed. Not going to quote as it would be too long.

 

What came first....the Chicken or the Egg? ;-)

 

I know Vista has been in development for a long time.........I know Roxio and all the other software developers have tried to be ready.

 

My arguement is that, and this is no gripe against MS as I believe I understand what they are faced with, no matter how much they test, prepare, beta etc. etc. etc., there are going to be issues to resolve. I ask you, have you ever seen ANY OS released that didn't have some things to be worked out, a time lag for compatible drivers and on and on?

 

It's just like a new model year for a car purchase or new model purchase of anything, there are going to be things to be worked out, fixed and changed once the initial release of a suppossedly "finalized" version is released for public "consumption".

 

All the manufacturers, including MS, even have this period of working out the bugs, fixes and updates in the budget. They know it's going to happen..........why shouldn't we expect it.

 

If I expect it, then my logic tells me to WAIT UNTIL this period is over so I don't have to go through the headaches. That's my reasoning and it has served me well.

 

By all means, if you want it.......go get it. But be ready for the inevitable "pains" that come with CHANGE.

 

I want Vista too as it has a lot to offer.........but I will wait until the chageover is complete and fixed, software developers, drivers and hardware have caught up. Then I will rush right out and get it.

[crhendo]

I have been for the most part over the years, with you on this opinion of waiting on new OS's to stabilize, proper hardware support, applications choices etc, prior to moving to a new OS. For the most part I think this is good advice in general and will keep many people from alot of headaches. However, in the case of Vista,...ramble ramble ramble....

 

Let me guess, you work for Roxio?

 

You certainly are entitled to your opinion and many (including me) would agree with most of the points you raise. The issue here is not that you don't want to buy Vista...we all understand that. The issue here is that Developer Kits, Beta Releases, Development Forums etc etc etc have been available for Vista for nearly 2 years. Roxio has had more than enough time to prepare the patches necessary to run under Vista. They are a very big company with a plethora of deveopment staff who are probably focussing on one thing at the moment.....getiing Version 10 out with Vista support so everybody needs to upgrade!!!

 

So this is the real reason they are late. The development team have slipped a little on the schedule to roll out Version 10!

 

I really hope that I'm wrong...but I guess we will see.

[grandpabruce]

The biggest problem with XP 64 Bruce was the initial lack of drivers - I had to wait over 3 months after release before I could use my Epson printer - &%$ to that the number of apps that failed to work (even in X86 mode) and I wound up removing it from my system.

 

Vista 64 will have the same problems - legacy stuff won't run, drivers will be scarce and who knows what other problems will arise.

 

On my laptop I have to use a USB to RS232 converter for operating my packet radio TNC - that is NOT supported under Vista or even under XP 64 and it's very unlikely it ever will be. I don't relish the thought of having to buy new hardware (presuming that even if I do it will be Vista compatible) when it works nicely under XP Home on the laptop

 

The lack of drivers and application compatibility is the reason I wonder why anyone would install XP 64 or any version of Vista.

 

I just ordered the full version of XP Pro. I did it before it becomes scarce or the price skyrockets.

[gi7omy]

The biggest problem with XP 64 Bruce was the initial lack of drivers - I had to wait over 3 months after release before I could use my Epson printer - &%$ to that the number of apps that failed to work (even in X86 mode) and I wound up removing it from my system.

 

Vista 64 will have the same problems - legacy stuff won't run, drivers will be scarce and who knows what other problems will arise.

 

On my laptop I have to use a USB to RS232 converter for operating my packet radio TNC - that is NOT supported under Vista or even under XP 64 and it's very unlikely it ever will be. I don't relish the thought of having to buy new hardware (presuming that even if I do it will be Vista compatible) when it works nicely under XP Home on the laptop

[grandpabruce]

I have no clue how many copies of XP64 have been sold, but I suspect that support has been limited due to the limited demand for that support.

[Beerman]

I agree with much of what you state however, the 'if you build it, they will come' mentality has taken over. To me, the thought of waiting in line at midnight just to buy an OS is ridiculous but I guess I'm just too old school. Greed is certainly a part and XP has been a fine OS and I'm sure, in the end, Vista will improve but something has to be done with the DRM side of it but I fear that won't happen soon. I think DRM helps to breed pirating even more!

[Atomic_Ed]

I see all these posts about Vista and I just have to ask, "Why are these people in such a hurry to upgrade to Vista?" If you don't have Vista then wait. If your machine came with Vista, then I guess you are stuck. If you are comtemplating buying a new computer than it will more than likely come with Vista.

 

There was a VERY GOOD article in MaximumPC that did a write up, "Do You Really Need Vista", or something to that effect.

 

Other than a few security features there were really only two reasons mentioned why you should be in a hurry to jump on the Vista band wagon.

 

1] The first was, you just can't live or just have to have the newer browser features.

2] You are going to buy or already have bought a DX10 compliant Video Card and are going to buy or have the few that are out there, DX10 games.

 

Other than those two features, it was suggested that there is no need to dive into Vista at this time.

 

No one at MaximumPC liked the DRM that Vista has. (Digital Rights Management) There are workarounds and perhaps someone with Vista can talk more about that.

 

I am not trying to persuade anyone NOT to buy it, but I do suggest you do your own research and decide if you really need it RIGHT NOW.

 

As for me, I will wait. I am not ready to go out and buy a DX10 card, prices too high and not much of a selection yet....and I will wait until MS is done fixing and tweaking Vista and really "finalize" the OS and then software developers can release their fixes and patches for their software for a finalized product.

 

But hey, you decide for yourself. Good luck and best wishes.

I have been for the most part over the years, with you on this opinion of waiting on new OS's to stabilize, proper hardware support, applications choices etc, prior to moving to a new OS. For the most part I think this is good advice in general and will keep many people from alot of headaches. However, in the case of Vista, I feel that there really is no excuse for the lack of proper software support and especially with x64 compatibility. Vista has been in development far longer than any other OS in history. In addition x64 XP Pro came out years ago and could have given good ground for vendors to develop x64 drivers and apps, yet very few did so. In addition to all of this x64 hardware based computers have been out for so long now that there are many already ready for retirement due to old age now and still no proper x64 support. You can also throw in the XP still has many of the quirks it did 6 years ago. It is old now and looks extremely dated compared to Vista and will not support the newest hardware coming out like DX10. Security is also a big concern for XP and we all know how that went with the OS over the years and while there has been improvements it is still not as secure as Vista and never will be.

 

To me all of this really deviates from the normal advice of waiting and anyone wanting to move to Vista I believe is justified. Heck if we waited much linger Vista or even x64 for the matter will eventually be replaced with yet another upgrade path. In the end I feel that all of this lack of support for so many years now is mostly due to companies viewing the whole x64 subject as a small segment and not wanting to put resources towards development. This sounds more like an accounting approach than a business development path. In other words don't spend any money towards x64 or Vista compatiblity until we have no choice since there aren't many running it yet. Well I can tell you that many companies have alienated alot of their customers with this approach and now with Vista coming standard on all new PCs, it is obvious the time to become compatible has passed. When you also further consider that Vista is also available in 32 bit versions there really is no reason it could not be properly supported by now and I think most people will gravitate towards companies who offer true supported applications moving forward regardless if they are different from the ones they loayally stuck by over the years.

 

Anyway, it is my opinion that the whole mess we are in right know has absolutely no excuse other than greed. No matter what the vendors think about Vista or x64 for that matter, it is here to stay and MS with it's mighty influence will push the currents forward and those fighting the current may tread water for a short while, but in the end will get swept away by its force. We have seen this same thing in the past with other OSs but for the industry to be this far behind when so many years have passed to develop for it, is simply ridiculous to me.

 

At this point I am looking for viable alternatives for all my apps that will properly run under Vista and if that means switching vendors or product, then so be it. I am not particularly directing my opinion here towards Roxio, but just to the industry in general.

 

I have Vista loaded on 3 of our home PCs and I am actively searching for compatible properly supported apps for them. As for the OS itself, I do not like DRM at all, not that I am a pirate or would do anything like that but just because of all the resouce load it puts on the hardware. Essentially we are buying faster and better hardware only to drag it down in performance due to all the DRM crap in Vista. Unfortunately we don't have any choice in the matter and I suspect as we move forward there will be more and more of this junk jammed down our throats. However Vista has proven extremely stable on the 3 machines I have it loaded on. Not a single glitch in any way have I seen yet. Other than the lack of proper app support by third party vendors.

 

Well heres hoping that companies start developing for the current OS and stop living in the past with XP. The time to move on is sorely overdue now and like it or not Vista is the current shipping OS and XP has been replaced just as Win2k, ME, 98, etc.

[Beerman]

I'm with you for the most part. I have it on a test system because I'm still testing a new part of Media Center and I'm also learning the good and the bad about Vista. I like much of it but certainly don't think it's worth upgrading to as I am really happy with XP and much of what Vista does/has, I can do with XP.

However, as I am sure most will end of with it in the future, I'm trying to look at the positive side as well and I can't find much that I despise about Vista so far other than the rush to get it.

I'm sure in about 4-6 months, all the drivers will be out to make Vista a better experience for all but in the mean time, I'm just a part of the other guinea pigs.

And, there will be away around the DRM issues as there always are. What MS builds, others can take down!

[FwFdfireman]

good mornig from Italy.

 

The Easy M.C.Suite 9 is compatible with VISTA-Premium?

Thank you - by

 

 

I see all these posts about Vista and I just have to ask, "Why are these people in such a hurry to upgrade to Vista?" If you don't have Vista then wait. If your machine came with Vista, then I guess you are stuck. If you are comtemplating buying a new computer than it will more than likely come with Vista.

 

There was a VERY GOOD article in MaximumPC that did a write up, "Do You Really Need Vista", or something to that effect.

 

Other than a few security features there were really only two reasons mentioned why you should be in a hurry to jump on the Vista band wagon.

 

1] The first was, you just can't live or just have to have the newer browser features.

2] You are going to buy or already have bought a DX10 compliant Video Card and are going to buy or have the few that are out there, DX10 games.

 

Other than those two features, it was suggested that there is no need to dive into Vista at this time.

 

No one at MaximumPC liked the DRM that Vista has. (Digital Rights Management) There are workarounds and perhaps someone with Vista can talk more about that.

 

I am not trying to persuade anyone NOT to buy it, but I do suggest you do your own research and decide if you really need it RIGHT NOW.

 

As for me, I will wait. I am not ready to go out and buy a DX10 card, prices too high and not much of a selection yet....and I will wait until MS is done fixing and tweaking Vista and really "finalize" the OS and then software developers can release their fixes and patches for their software for a finalized product.

 

But hey, you decide for yourself. Good luck and best wishes.

[Beerman]

good mornig from Italy.

 

The Easy M.C.Suite 9 is compatible with VISTA-Premium?

Thank you - by

Yes it is but there are problems with Drag to Disc so many have suggested to remove Drag to Disc after the install since it can't be removed in a custom install.

I've had no other problems with it though some have posted in the forum that they are having some problems.

You should read a bit more of the forums and decide for yourself.