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mindy01

NTLDR is missing after installing EMC 10

Question

Bought EMC 10 when I got the upgrade email, through the download service. Installed it no problem and began to poke around a bit. No issues. Then came back yesterday and noticed that nothing was working from the "web" style front-page. When I tried to click on the caputure video, nothing happend. Other links did not work as well and some threw up error messages. Decided to reinstall again. After the rebott, my Windows XP wouldn't come up, left with a message of "NTLDR is missing, press any key to restart" at a black screen. Could not get around this, had to google search, get a file, reboot from floppy, etc. Whole workaround. Did a system restore back before EMC 10 and everything was fine. Tried install again. Rebot machine and NTLDR gone again. Finally got back to XP and got rid of EMC 10, went back and reinstalled EMC 9. I am asking for refund of EMC 10.

Edited by Tom at Roxio

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I too got the ntldr missing error after installing two different times. This is DEFINATELY related to the installation of Roxio EMC 10. PLEASE does anyone have a solution other than saying it can't be EMC10?

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Please don't answer your own questions

 

This has happened on machines that do NOT have Roxio products installed - or do you think that someone loaded a Roxio product on them?

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Why are you so defensive about this? You are acting like you wrote the program. I am sure that you are quite a bit more knowledgeable than I, but some of us have problems with certain aspects of EMC10 that we would like to get corrected. You aren't helping with statements like this. I don't believe anyone has said that other programs could not cause computer problems. That is NOT the point. The point that you seem to continue to miss is that THIS program is causing a problem. It appears to have erased all files on the C:\ drive that were not in a folder. That is not a good thing to happen and very hard on marketing. <_<

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I'm not being defensive about anything - simply stating a fact that I've seen that happen in the past few months on a couple of my customers' computers that never HAD any Roxio software installed, ergo, if it happens without any Roxio s/w being present, it can't be down to that

 

To blame one app for causing a fault that has occurred on other machines that don't have it installed is akin to blaming the power company who supply the EMF to work the computer.

 

I'm not disputing that it's happening - and to be honest, I'd dearly love to know just why and how - but it is happening and so far no-one has been able to pin down a common source

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I too got the ntldr missing error after installing two different times. This is DEFINATELY related to the installation of Roxio EMC 10. PLEASE does anyone have a solution other than saying it can't be EMC10?

 

I am just curious, but do you have on your "C" drive a "boot.ini" file ? if so what does it read ? Sometimes if the required files are not present on your computer, it will revert to the boot.ini file to continue.

 

The problem might be that you are missing some other file/s besides the ntldr. (NT Loader).

 

Frank...

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I quoted my previous note to this thread since it's now way back. I seem to have had the worst experience of anyone. After what happened below, and following some of the more reasonable advice (I found it REALLY helpful for someone to keep posting that they've seen this on machines without EMC 10, so therefore this can't be caused by EMC 10. . . great logic!)

 

I emailed Roxio support about 12 days ago asking for help and a refund. . . they have yet to reply! The latest is that I've had to take my hard disk to a repair facility to try to recover the data on it. My tries at reinstalling Windows XP led to error messages that the file system on my hard disk was not recognized. Wish me luck retrieving the data. Estimate for data recovery: $1,800 plus the cost of a new hard drive.

 

Sandy

 

 

 

 

 

I had exactly the same situation when "upgrading" from 9 to 10. Install worked initially, then various components wouldn't load so, as I've learned to do by using EMC 9, I uninstalled and reinstalled. Now my system won't boot and gives the Can't find NTLDR error when it tries. I went to the web and tried the fixes that are there, and they won't work on my system. Apparently EMC 10 renamed by boot drive at it can't be found. If I try to roload the operating system, it says it can't find a boot partition and asks if I want to create one. I assume I shouldn't if I don't want to lose all my precious files. When I do the Windows XP Recovery routine, it says my root drive is drive J: (used to be C:) and my second hard disc (used to be D:) is C:. All the directories are visible in the MSDOS mode of Recovery, but none of the files are accessible. They all say access denied when I try to open their directories (Rocovery asks for Administrator password, which I entered).

 

Only advice the IS people can give me is to buy a new system and install the hard drives on the new system so I can save all my data files. Roxio should pay for my new system as well as refund my upgrade cost of for EMC 10. I expect to see a lot more of this issue in the near future from other users.

 

Sandy

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OK. Last night I decided to follow some more of the helpful hints I found here.

 

Spent several hours of fun. Closed out all but keyboard and mouse with msconfig. Followed all of the directions for the clean install. Deleted all references to Roxio and Sonic. Re-installed Roxio (number 6 or 7 times now) copied back my boot.ini, ntldr and ntdetect which were again erased, then booted with almost everything still closed by msconfig.

 

Started Roxio and lo and behold it seemed to be working at first. Tried to bring up a few functions, then hit a wall at VideoWave which shut down. Have to go to work and will try some of the other functions later. Still doesn't seem to be right.

 

By my rough estimate, I have now spent 12 to 15 hours with this and feel that I am beta testing a program for which I paid good money. I am still waiting to hear back from "support" after sending them my logged files.

 

Above was questioned about what was in the boot.ini:

[boot loader]

timeout=30

default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS

[operating systems]

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition" /fastdetect /NoExecute=OptIn

 

I am not sure what other files were wiped from the C drive other than boot.ini, ntldr and ntdetect as these are necessary to boot.

 

Is there an easy way to list my computer components for the signature?

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(I found it REALLY helpful for someone to keep posting that they've seen this on machines without EMC 10, so therefore this can't be caused by EMC 10. . . great logic!)

 

Sandy

 

It's a shade more logical than blaming one app out of all the stuff on your drive for the problem - because it happened after you installed one partuicular app is following the illogic of 'post hoc ergo propter hoc' That is untrue in almost all cases.

 

I repeat what I said before - this particular fault has started occurring comparatively recently and is happening on machines which do NOT have EMC installed. I can sympathise with you on data loss (and if you'd asked about data recovery, I could have given you pointers to how it could be done without paying through the nose for it).

 

Tom - go to 'My Controls' when you log on and scroll down on the left and you will see a link 'Edit Signature'

Edited by gi7omy

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Above was questioned about what was in the boot.ini:

[boot loader]

timeout=30

default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS

[operating systems]

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition" /fastdetect /NoExecute=OptIn

Well.... Seems that there is something amiss in the EMC10 install routine. there are a few reports of the files required to boot coming up missing after an install

 

If you look at the boot.ini file above, you can see that Tom2's OS is installed on the second partition. (first partition = partition(0), not partition(1)).

 

Oem machines that have the OS pre-installed typically include a FAT partition of some type in which system utilities are stored. This partition is usually hidden & inactive. If you ever get on the phone with the maker of the machine, they will instruct you you to unhide the partition so you can get to the utilities. That helps phone support figure out your problem.

 

gi7omy... There have been posts that after the install of EMC10, users drives are re-lettered and from time to time the rig is not bootable because necessary boot files are missing.

 

Maybe the partition that the OS is installed on has something to do with it. Maybe someone at Roxio can check it out.

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Well.... Seems that there is something amiss in the EMC10 install routine. there are a few reports of the files required to boot coming up missing after an install
It may appear that way, but if there REALLY was a problem with the EMC installer then every person that installed EDMC 10 would be having the exact same problem which isn't the case. I, personally, have installed and uninstalled EMC 10 many times trying to reproduce some of these problems and just has never happened. The problems I have run across were because of things I have done and not the program.

 

On my HP Media Center by default, the restore partition (which is the first partition) is not hidden. I renamed it myself to Z: and hid it. I haven't had any problems installing any software because of that. So partition(1) would be correct in my case.

 

Although I can sympathize with Sandy's loss, it also shows that she should have had a back up system in place. I have 20 yrs of genealogy work on my computer. I have backups for my backups and those copies are not stored in my home.

Edited by ggrussell

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It may appear that way, but if there REALLY was a problem with the EMC installer then every person that installed EDMC 10 would be having the exact same problem which isn't the case. I, personally, have installed and uninstalled EMC 10 many times trying to reproduce some of these problems and just has never happened. The problems I have run across were because of things I have done and not the program.

 

On my HP Media Center by default, the restore partition (which is the first partition) is not hidden. I renamed it myself to Z: and hid it. I haven't had any problems installing any software because of that. So partition(1) would be correct in my case.

 

Although I can sympathize with Sandy's loss, it also shows that she should have had a back up system in place. I have 20 yrs of genealogy work on my computer. I have backups for my backups and those copies are not stored in my home.

If EVERY person had the same rig, drivers, hardware & software, you may have a point but everyones rig & setup are probably different.

 

Because there have been a few reports of the same problem, and I saw the boot.ini file, I thought it may deserve a little further investigation.

 

However since you have throughly investigated the problem, I guess we can rule it out. Must be a problem with the users setup and EMC has nothing to do with it.

 

Thanks for the tip on backups.

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I quoted my previous note to this thread since it's now way back. I seem to have had the worst experience of anyone. After what happened below, and following some of the more reasonable advice (I found it REALLY helpful for someone to keep posting that they've seen this on machines without EMC 10, so therefore this can't be caused by EMC 10. . . great logic!)

 

I emailed Roxio support about 12 days ago asking for help and a refund. . . they have yet to reply! The latest is that I've had to take my hard disk to a repair facility to try to recover the data on it. My tries at reinstalling Windows XP led to error messages that the file system on my hard disk was not recognized. Wish me luck retrieving the data. Estimate for data recovery: $1,800 plus the cost of a new hard drive.

 

Sandy

 

Before you pay to have that data recovered, if you have another drive that you can install the OS on, do that, and connect the troubled drive as a slave, and see if you can get XP to recognize it, after boot up.

 

BTW, $1800 is a big ripoff. If you have to have the data recovered, find somewhere else to get it done.

Edited by grandpabruce

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Well.... Seems that there is something amiss in the EMC10 install routine. there are a few reports of the files required to boot coming up missing after an install

 

If you look at the boot.ini file above, you can see that Tom2's OS is installed on the second partition. (first partition = partition(0), not partition(1)).

 

Oem machines that have the OS pre-installed typically include a FAT partition of some type in which system utilities are stored. This partition is usually hidden & inactive. If you ever get on the phone with the maker of the machine, they will instruct you you to unhide the partition so you can get to the utilities. That helps phone support figure out your problem.

 

gi7omy... There have been posts that after the install of EMC10, users drives are re-lettered and from time to time the rig is not bootable because necessary boot files are missing.

 

Maybe the partition that the OS is installed on has something to do with it. Maybe someone at Roxio can check it out.

 

Not sure if the OP's Boot.ini file is bad barryware. I have a custom built computer and have a retail copy of XP/SP2 I installed myself and the partitions seem to be pretty much the same as the OP's file as far as "partition" is concerned. And I have no other partitions on my boot drive.

 

My Boot.ini file reads:

 

;

[boot loader]

timeout=30

default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS

[operating sytems]

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition"/FASTDETECT/USEPMTIMER/NOEXECUTE=OPTIN

 

Frank...

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Not sure if the OP's Boot.ini file is bad barryware. I have a custom built computer and have a retail copy of XP/SP2 I installed myself and the partitions seem to be pretty much the same as the OP's file as far as "partition" is concerned. And I have no other partitions on my boot drive.

 

My Boot.ini file reads:

 

;

[boot loader]

timeout=30

default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS

[operating sytems]

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition"/FASTDETECT/USEPMTIMER/NOEXECUTE=OPTIN

 

Frank...

I didn't say it was a bad boot.ini. I just noticed the OS is on part(1). I have a dual boot machine and the default OS is on part(0) and the second OS is on part(1).

 

My Dual Boot:

 

[boot loader]

timeout=5

default=multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(0)\WINDOWS

[operating systems]

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(0)\WINDOWS="(1) Microsoft Windows Media Center Edition 2005" /noexecute=optin /fastdetect

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINDOWS="(2) Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /noexecute=optin /fastdetect

 

I have a laptop that still has the utility partition and the OS is installed on part(1), not (0).

 

Just something to check that's all.

 

Actually.... I think someone else on a different thread may have it figured out. They suspect that after the install completes and removes and temporary install files, it is also taking files in the root directory that are not in folders with it. That user theorized that the temp install files are being written to the root directory of the drive instead of the system temp directory.

 

Might have something to do with the files attributes.

 

One user has a problem.. Thats one thing. Two.... Maybe. But 3,4,+ all reporting the boot files are missing after install and a couple have reported that it is repeatable.... I think that deserves some real attention from the engineers at Roxio.. Can't have software installs destroying users rigs.

 

Red... Let me ask you a question. You are a Guru and I understand that one of the perks / responsibilities of Guru is beta testing new software...

 

How large is Roxio's beta pool? How long is the beta test before the commercial release?

Edited by barryware

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One user has a problem.. Thats one thing. Two.... Maybe. But 3,4,+ all reporting the boot files are missing after install and a couple have reported that it is repeatable.... I think that deserves some real attention from the engineers at Roxio.. Can't have software installs destroying users rigs.

 

You have a point here. I'll make sure this is looked into. I'll let you guys know if we need any additional information from you guys regarding the details of the issue.

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...

Just something to check that's all.

 

Actually.... I think someone else on a different thread may have it figured out. They suspect that after the install completes and removes and temporary install files, it is also taking files in the root directory that are not in folders with it. That user theorized that the temp install files are being written to the root directory of the drive instead of the system temp directory.

 

Might have something to do with the files attributes.

 

One user has a problem.. Thats one thing. Two.... Maybe. But 3,4,+ all reporting the boot files are missing after install and a couple have reported that it is repeatable.... I think that deserves some real attention from the engineers at Roxio.. Can't have software installs destroying users rigs.

 

Red... Let me ask you a question. You are a Guru and I understand that one of the perks / responsibilities of Guru is beta testing new software...

 

How large is Roxio's beta pool? How long is the beta test before the commercial release?

Hi Barry,

We had a very good group of beta testers outside of Roxio. The beta testing started weeks before the release. I found the quality of our beta testers to be extremely high... they were very responsive and very thorough. This is in addition to the hundreds of people and many thousands of hours of testing performed internally. We would love to have an even bigger pool of beta testers (although we prefer quality of feedback over quantity of feedback when it comes to beta testing).

 

I agree that this problem is worth investigating, and we will investigate it.

 

People who have experienced the problem will need to boot from a Windows XP CD, then restore their boot files. I realize that this is not easy to do. In this case the hard drive is not destroyed, but certain files needed to boot from the hard drive were deleted and must be replaced before you will be able to boot from this drive again.

 

An expensive data recovery service would not seem to be the best choice in this case. The drive is apparently still functioning perfectly, and files can be read from the drive. Data recovery services are more appropriate for drives that crash, or have other physical / electrical problems.

 

Tom

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Thanks for listening to the problems and taking a look into it.

 

I have read of an additional content file. When I did the download, there was only one file downloaded and I am not prompted to add any additional files after the install. Is there something else that should have downloaded with the file?

 

Is it possible that the install from CD is different from the downloaded file? Are the missing ntldr, etc only occuring with the downloaded file?

 

Forgot to ask if there is an easy way to copy the information of my computer setup to the signature block like many have or is it all typed in?

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Thanks for listening to the problems and taking a look into it.

 

I have read of an additional content file. When I did the download, there was only one file downloaded and I am not prompted to add any additional files after the install. Is there something else that should have downloaded with the file?

 

Is it possible that the install from CD is different from the downloaded file? Are the missing ntldr, etc only occuring with the downloaded file?

 

Forgot to ask if there is an easy way to copy the information of my computer setup to the signature block like many have or is it all typed in?

Depends on the size of the file downloaded whether it contains the content or not. Was it a 700+mb file or a 1.5gb file?

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Thanks for listening to the problems and taking a look into it.

 

I have read of an additional content file. When I did the download, there was only one file downloaded and I am not prompted to add any additional files after the install. Is there something else that should have downloaded with the file?

 

Is it possible that the install from CD is different from the downloaded file? Are the missing ntldr, etc only occuring with the downloaded file?

 

Forgot to ask if there is an easy way to copy the information of my computer setup to the signature block like many have or is it all typed in?

 

Go to the top of the forum screen and click on "My Controls". On the left hand side of that screen you will se several options where you can add text for your computer setup etc.

 

Frank...

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Mindy01 ...

You don't have a virus and there is probably nothing wrong with your hard disk.

 

I first had this problem when installing/uninstalling roxio 6 some time ago on a brand new OS installation. Prior to installing Roxio 6 I had re-assigned some of my drive letters and after installing Roxio they were changed back. I changed them again (big mistake) and then applied a bunch of update/patches to the roxio. The drive letters were again changed back. So again I changed them back to what I wanted them to be. It turned out roxio would not recognize either of my cd/dvd drives so I had to uninstall it anyhow. That's when things blew up. I could still boot but windows didn't show some drives as having letters so they would not show up in windows explorer. When I tried to assign letters to them (see item 3 below) I could not. They had become unassigned. No letter associated with them. I re-installed at that point and picked up roxio 8.

 

Here is some history.

Several MS OS's back (and starting with MS DOS) drives were assigned letters based on specific criteria.

Check the "Order of assignment" section in this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drive_letter_assignment

The drives are still assigned that way even when installing XP.

There are a number ways drive letters might "not" be assigned that way. Here are a few.

 

1. If you have two disks in your system at installation and you choose to install on the second one instead of the first and if both are unpartitioned or unformatted at the time (so they don't have a drive letter assigned to them yet). In this case the second drive will become C: and the first D:

 

2. IF you have one disk and partition it into two disks the primary partition will be C: and the next one will be D:. If you add another disk it will be E: in this scenario where as if you had both disks installed at the time of installation Disk1 partition 1 would be C: and disk2 would be D: and Disk1 partition 2 would be E:. You get the idea.

 

3. IF you change your drive letters manually. Without going into why, the need to re-assign drive letters was implimented several OS ago and now the user can change their letters through Control panel->administrative tools->computer management->storage->disk management then select a drive on the right and right click-> change drive letters and paths. A box pops up and one thing is shows you is the currently assigned letter for that drive and you can change it here too.

 

What that all has to do with Roxio...

This info regarding drive assignments can also be damaged or the drive(s) can become "unassigned" (another form of damaged). This doesn't affect the info on the drives but what happens is the OS no longer understands which one is which so it cannot boot. This is what is going on here with roxio.

 

I do not know why Roxio does this but for whatever reason Roxio during the install process re-assigns the drive letters using the order described in that article above. Most people never realize this happens because the drive order stays the same as how it already was. Some of us though who have our drives assigned differently for whatever reason can run smack into this problem. Now then this is an eduguess but I "believe" that as long as Roxio is installed you are alright but it's when you uninstall that this problem can crop up. Don't know if it always happens or if there are other criteria involved that affect it or what. That's about as much as I know about it.

 

[Edit] As an after thought here I also "beleive" it could happen after the install but before uninstalling if your C: drive is not your the first disk in the system like in scenario 1 above or if you have a zip disk on the system with your hard disk during the initial windows install (then the zip will be considered the 1st disk according to MS even though you can't install to it.). In those cases after roxio re-assigns the drive letters your C: drive won't be C: any longer which would also cause the missing ntldr error after rebooting

Edited by jd91651

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... for whatever reason Roxio during the install process re-assigns the drive letters using the order described in that article above.

 

Hi jd91651,

This is an interesting theory... worth investigating. It would be helpful if anyone who has experienced the problem could let us know if they have multiple hard drives on their system.

 

In the meantime I've passed this feedback along to our engineers.

 

Thanks

Tom

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Yes, I have three drives C: (main), D (second hard drive) and a USB hd

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Hi jd91651,

This is an interesting theory... worth investigating. It would be helpful if anyone who has experienced the problem could let us know if they have multiple hard drives on their system.

 

In the meantime I've passed this feedback along to our engineers.

 

Thanks

Tom

This happened to me with EMC10 but I wasn't alert at the time if it was V10 or not. Why? After I installed it, I didn't immediately reboot to check it out. I had work to do and my machine was left on overnight and when I rebooted much more than 12 hours (and a good nights sleep) later, it hit me. I wasn't even thinking that I installed new software. Just got my XP disc out and fixed the problem.

Yes, I have multiple drives. Had 2 then so what you see in my sig was added after this happened. Sorry, but since I was caught not at full attention, I don't have any other helpful info I can add.

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I have a Toshiba single 60GB Laptop centino with WinXP/sp2 that had Sonic Record Now installed on the computer by Toshiba. The new CD installation I received yesterday also made my laptop useless with the ntdlr missing after 4 hours trying to install EMC10. The only way I got everything back up and running was to slave the drive with my desktop, then replace the ntldr file. Win XP recovery would not work.

Now, I still don't have EMC10 and all my previous Sonic Record Now files are gone and no way to replace them. The new EMC10 CD install does not see ALL previous versions of Sonic or Roxio and the cleaning all previous versions and files advised by the support website won't work. The CD drive still works but the CD burner is useless. PLEASE PLEASE help us Roxio. Thank you

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