Toast 9 Compatibility Question

[Xaqtly]

We recently got two DVD burners at work, Lite-On model DX-20A3H05C. We were using OS 10.4.9 and Toast 7 and 8, and everything was working. Then we upgraded to OS 10.4.11, and we started having problems with those burners in Toast 7 and 8. They would burn discs but fail to verify, they would just get stuck on the verify screen.

 

For us, verifying is an absolute necessity. We burn multiple DVDs per day for archiving, and they must pass verification before we can put them away. So currently we can't use Toast 7 or 8 to do this, we had to resort to using a different program. We would like to get Toast 9, but we need to be sure that it's going to work with these burners in 10.4.11. Since apparently Roxio doesn't see the need to make trial versions of Toast 9 available, I was hoping somebody could verify the compatibility with these burners and that OS version before we shell out $200.

 

Can anybody verify compatibility, or maybe point me to a compatibility list?

[tsantee]

Are these internal or external drives?

 

Since the problem happened after updating to 10.4.11 I suggest downloading and applying the 10.4.11 combined system update on top of your existing 10.4.11. It won't do any harm and is know to fix odd problems that can occur after doing an incremental system update.

[Xaqtly]

They're external USB drives attached to 1st gen Intel iMacs. For what it's worth, these Macs were upgraded to 10.4.11 with the combo updater, not Software Update. Also FWIW, we were able to successfully burn and verify DVDs using Toast 7 and 8 using the internal Superdrives that shipped with the iMacs, so the problem seems to be related to these external Lite-On burners specifically, in conjunction with 10.4.11 and Toast 7 and 8. We can't use the internal Superdrives because they're way, WAY too slow. The external ones are on the order of 4 times faster.

 

These burners are pretty new, they definitely came out after the last Toast 8 update. We just got them about 3 weeks ago. I was hoping Toast 9 was just more compatible with these specific burners.

[tsantee]

If a drive is recognized by the Mac OS as being capable of burning discs, then Toast works with it. Macs, on the other hand, do better with Firewire drives than with USB 2 drives. I suggest going to xlr8yourmac.com and look up your specific drives in the site's drive compatibility database. This is where users report their experiences with different drives on different Macs.

 

Although your drives are new, check if any firmware updates are available from Lite-on. Also, check the Lite-on site for specific brands of media that they say are supported by those drives. There is a lot of troublesome discs being manufactured.

 

Another thing to try is to choose Save as Disc Image from Toast's File menu and then burn the disc image using the Image File setting in the Copy window. My hunch is you won't get any verification errors using that strategy.

[John at Roxio]

If a drive is recognized by the Mac OS as being capable of burning discs, then Toast works with it.

 

Exactly. That is our compatibility list.

 

If you purchase Toast directly from us you have a 30 day money back guarantee

[Xaqtly]

Cool. Well like I said, Toast does recognize the drives, and will burn discs. The problem is it can't get through the verification process. And I know it's not the media, because everything worked fine in 10.4.9. Same media, same burners, same copies of Toast. When I moved to 10.4.11, Toast was unable to verify the discs any more when burned with the Lite-On burners.

 

In any case we've ordered a copy of Toast 9, so we'll see how that goes. I'll post back here with results, thanks for the advice. We'll have 30 days to troubleshoot everything else in the process if it doesn't work right away.

[Xaqtly]

We got our copy of Toast 9 today, and after installing it and running a bunch of tests, I found that we're still having the same problem. So to recap:

 

• We're using Toast 9 Titanium

• We're using it on 1.83 GHz Intel iMacs

• We're running OS 10.4.11

• The burners are Lite-On external burners, Toast identifies them as Atapi DVD A DH20A3H

• The burners are connected via USB 2

• In 10.4.9, using the same burners and media and Toast 7 and 8, it worked fine

 

The problem: Toast has no problem seeing and identifying the burners, and in fact has no problem burning DVDs. The problem is in the verification process. We need Toast to verify the DVDs because these are backups for a production shop and we have to make sure the data is intact after the burn. So in testing with the above setup, here's what I found.

 

• Burn as DVD-ROM (UDF): The disc burns, verifies to 100% and then stops.It doesn't go back to the main screen and doesn't eject the DVD.

• Burn as Mac & PC: The disc burns, Toast write the lead-out, then it stops at 0% verification.

• Burn as Mac Only: The disc burns, Toast write the lead-out, then it stops at 0% verification.

• Burn as Copy Image File: The disc burns, verifies to 100% and then stops.It doesn't go back to the main screen and doesn't eject the DVD.

 

In all cases, we were unable to confirm that the disc had been successfully verified, even though they all worked fine afterwards. The point is that this is a production environment and we don't have time to go over the contents of every DVD we burn one file at a time to make sure everything was burned to the disc.

 

What I found: When Toast was stuck at either 100% or 0% depending on how we burned the disc, I found that I could get Toast to go back to normal again by turning the burner off. The only other way to get out of it was to force Toast to quit. It seems like Toast has a problem with these burners when it comes to verification - but again, Toast worked fine with these burners before we went to 10.4.11.

 

What I tried: To try to troubleshoot this on my end, I tried a few things to see if they would help.

 

• I ran DiskWarrior and replaced the file structure on the hard drive

• I repaired permissions

• I repaired the volume (with Disk Utility)

• I reinstalled 10.4.11 from the Combo Updater (Intel).

• I booted in Safe Mode.

 

None of these things made a difference, and in Safe Mode I couldn't get Toast to launch at all.

 

So I'm not sure what else I can do on my end, but I'd be willing to do more testing if it'll help. It's looking like our only option may be to revert back to 10.4.9. In the meantime we're using a freeware burning program that has no problems burning and verifying DVDs. We would prefer to use Toast though, because the freeware app is a bit clunky. Thanks for any help.

[tsantee]

I can tell it has been very aggravating and time consuming for you. Your description suggests to me that some change in the OS updates make the Mac less compatible with that brand and model of drive. I checked the Liteon site and see there is a firmware update for the DH-20A3H dated November 2007. Lite-on requires connecting its drives to a PC in order to flash firmware updates. Updating the firmware is the last thing I'd try before scrapping those drives for a pair of LaCie Firewire drives.

[Xaqtly]

Heh, I went to check out the firmware updates and the link doesn't go anywhere. Oh well. I took the iMacs back down to 10.4.9, and now everything works perfectly again. So Toast 9 didn't make any difference per se, I observed the same problem with Toast 7, 8 and 9 in 10.4.11 - and Toast 7, 8 and 9 all worked fine when the iMacs were back on 10.4.9.

 

This is an odd and very specific problem, and the only way to recreate it is to include all three factors: The DH20A3H burners, Toast (apparently any version), and 10.4.11. If you change any one of those variables, everything works again. I didn't get a chance to try it in 10.5, mostly because as a production shop we're under heavy deadlines every day and I really didn't have time to experiment to that degree. And there may be more factors beyond what I was able to test, like whether or not it's only on Intel Macs, or whether a Firewire version of that burner would have made a difference.

 

In any case it's working fine in 10.4.9, and these iMacs just burn DVDs so they don't really have to be upgraded for any reason other than just keeping them current with the rest of the shop. Thanks for the advice along the way, feedback is good.

[richard_briscoe]

We recently got two DVD burners at work, Lite-On model DX-20A3H05C. We were using OS 10.4.9 and Toast 7 and 8, and everything was working. Then we upgraded to OS 10.4.11, and we started having problems with those burners in Toast 7 and 8. They would burn discs but fail to verify, they would just get stuck on the verify screen.

 

For us, verifying is an absolute necessity. We burn multiple DVDs per day for archiving, and they must pass verification before we can put them away. So currently we can't use Toast 7 or 8 to do this, we had to resort to using a different program. We would like to get Toast 9, but we need to be sure that it's going to work with these burners in 10.4.11. Since apparently Roxio doesn't see the need to make trial versions of Toast 9 available, I was hoping somebody could verify the compatibility with these burners and that OS version before we shell out $200.

 

Can anybody verify compatibility, or maybe point me to a compatibility list?

 

I think that Toast has problems with its verification. That is to say I am not convinced that all of its verification "errors" are, in point of actual fact, errors. I too have experienced such errors with OS 10.5.2 and now 10.5.3 with Toast 9.0.2 when burning disc images. As I recall it there were some issues along this line in OS 10.4.x with Toast 7.x as well.

 

I use Verbatim discs which I believe are about as good as I can get. That is not to say that they are "perfect", but then what is? The video discs that I have played which Toast 9 reported as failing a particular check point played OK, but you never know whether that was because there was no error or the error was not critical. I certainly share your concern about data integrity.

 

I would suggest tracking down the firmware update for your Lite-On. Just start with Yahoo! or Google and you should find it somewhere or other. Firmware updates are frequently made for improved media compatibility. If you have access to a PC, just take the USB case with the drive in it and update it that way. That is what I do for the most part. I have also updated firmware using Virtual PC and the USB case. I do not know if this will work with Parallels or Fusion on the Intel Macs or not.

 

External Optical Drives are pretty cheap now. You can get a Pioneer DVR-115 from NewEgg for about $31 in Black or Beige plus $7 shipping. You might be able to find them for a bit less elsewhere, but I have had good luck with them actually having things in stock and shipping them promptly.

 

I remember reading a thread on one or the other of the forums which suggested cleaning the heads on a problematic optical drive. I suppose that is one option just to make sure that it is not an issue. I have one drive (out of service) that Toast just never liked for some reason that I suppose I ought to clean and see if it is salvageable to put in an older machine that does not need one most of the time.